You know, that 20000-30000 premium over ICEs does buy a lot of gas over lifetime. And I’d rather not rent computers on wheels which depend on random clouds.
I’ve got a new Mitsubishi ASX 8 years (wow, time flies) ago without a cellular modem for some 17 kEUR, since we could’t get the 15 kEUR model. I could imagine an ICE car of that size goes for 20-25 kEUR these days.
An EV (not Chinese) without range anxiety (500+ km) and of about that size is probably 40-60 kEUR.
Since I cannot get anything new but a cloud-tied snitch on wheels I guess I need to buy used, or disable the cellular antenna.
I can’t comment on connectivity, as that is a personal preference.
I respect it though, but have given up myself.
Having a safer car with creature comforts outweighs the benefit of complete privacy for me. I’d probably think differently if I didn’t have a familiy to keep safe….
Regarding range: 500+ km is super nice, but not necessary for most people. Our shortest range EV is 406 WLTP, so realistically only 300 in winter conditions. That’s 2-3 hours of driving between every charge stop, which we need to do to eat/relax/use the bathroom anyways.
In summer it’s even further.
Charging takes 15-30 minutes, depending on SoC when we stop.
For any trip shorter than this and in every day life, we don’t need to stop at all as I can charge both at home and at work.
I get that might not be the case for most people, of course.
I hear you, but GPS trail snitching, constant OTA updates and car bricking because some cloud server somehere went down is a hard no. Apart from air conditioning I don’t need any extras. I bring my own navigation, and need no radio. I guess my next one will be a used car, unless I can find one without or disable onboard snitches.
As to 500 km, we drive 4000 km when on vacation, the charger network is thin enough so you have to plan your journey around it. Finding working gas stations within range is hard enough e.g. in rural France. Having to carry a dozen charging provider cards and manually picking the cheapest is for the birds. At work finding an underground parking with a charger is not easy. Lucky thing I telecommute and take public transport (which is barely working in Germany). There is perhaps some point having a small EV charged at home, but since I don’t commute it’s a needless luxury. Juice is some 0.3 EUR/kWh at home and looking at https://www.voltflow.net/blog/ev-charging-cost-germany-2026 EV is barely cheaper than a borderline efficient ICE.
What currency are you using for this comparison? Definitely not USD.
A Tesla Model 3 runs for about $40k. A Camry runs for about $35k. Or if we want to go down market a Nissan Leaf is about $30k and probably comparable to a $25k Sentra.
Similar trim levels of vehicles offered as both EV and gasoline powered show minimal difference. Compare the Ford F-150 Lariat in both the gasoline ($75k) and the EV versions ($79k). Or the new Lexus ES, where the EV ($49k) is actually cheaper than the hybrid ($51k).
And if you go into the used market, EVs are starting to hit that market in real numbers, too. Plenty of options for under $20,000, and a handful of options for under $10,000.
Cars are expensive. EVs generally are close to that already expensive price.
You know, that 20000-30000 premium over ICEs does buy a lot of gas over lifetime. And I’d rather not rent computers on wheels which depend on random clouds.
New ICE cars are just as much computers as EV’s are.
And mind me asking where you live where they are 20-30k higher?
Must be comparing Hyundais to Lucids.
I’ve got a new Mitsubishi ASX 8 years (wow, time flies) ago without a cellular modem for some 17 kEUR, since we could’t get the 15 kEUR model. I could imagine an ICE car of that size goes for 20-25 kEUR these days.
An EV (not Chinese) without range anxiety (500+ km) and of about that size is probably 40-60 kEUR.
Since I cannot get anything new but a cloud-tied snitch on wheels I guess I need to buy used, or disable the cellular antenna.
I can’t comment on connectivity, as that is a personal preference.
I respect it though, but have given up myself.
Having a safer car with creature comforts outweighs the benefit of complete privacy for me. I’d probably think differently if I didn’t have a familiy to keep safe….
Regarding range: 500+ km is super nice, but not necessary for most people. Our shortest range EV is 406 WLTP, so realistically only 300 in winter conditions. That’s 2-3 hours of driving between every charge stop, which we need to do to eat/relax/use the bathroom anyways.
In summer it’s even further.
Charging takes 15-30 minutes, depending on SoC when we stop.
For any trip shorter than this and in every day life, we don’t need to stop at all as I can charge both at home and at work.
I get that might not be the case for most people, of course.
I hear you, but GPS trail snitching, constant OTA updates and car bricking because some cloud server somehere went down is a hard no. Apart from air conditioning I don’t need any extras. I bring my own navigation, and need no radio. I guess my next one will be a used car, unless I can find one without or disable onboard snitches.
As to 500 km, we drive 4000 km when on vacation, the charger network is thin enough so you have to plan your journey around it. Finding working gas stations within range is hard enough e.g. in rural France. Having to carry a dozen charging provider cards and manually picking the cheapest is for the birds. At work finding an underground parking with a charger is not easy. Lucky thing I telecommute and take public transport (which is barely working in Germany). There is perhaps some point having a small EV charged at home, but since I don’t commute it’s a needless luxury. Juice is some 0.3 EUR/kWh at home and looking at https://www.voltflow.net/blog/ev-charging-cost-germany-2026 EV is barely cheaper than a borderline efficient ICE.
Fud
I guess we’re stuck with buying old ICE cars then
What currency are you using for this comparison? Definitely not USD.
A Tesla Model 3 runs for about $40k. A Camry runs for about $35k. Or if we want to go down market a Nissan Leaf is about $30k and probably comparable to a $25k Sentra.
Similar trim levels of vehicles offered as both EV and gasoline powered show minimal difference. Compare the Ford F-150 Lariat in both the gasoline ($75k) and the EV versions ($79k). Or the new Lexus ES, where the EV ($49k) is actually cheaper than the hybrid ($51k).
And if you go into the used market, EVs are starting to hit that market in real numbers, too. Plenty of options for under $20,000, and a handful of options for under $10,000.
Cars are expensive. EVs generally are close to that already expensive price.
fud
bull
I thought you meant the ICEstapo and I was like “yeah, you’re almost magnitude of order off what they get paid”